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Post by Zscout on Dec 21, 2014 14:12:40 GMT -8
I noticed that when I go to evolve some cards, that they do not show any upgrade associated with the evolve.
For example, Speed Piker does not show any potential gains when evolving.
Not sure if this is intentional or just an oversight.
There are other cards that don't seem to upgrade upon evolve as well, but I can't remember them off hand. If this is not intentional, I will start listing them as I notice.
Thanks
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Post by Some guy on Dec 21, 2014 14:36:18 GMT -8
I think the are evolving it's just harder to tell.
One example would be their speed which is in the top right corner. Which is easily missed.
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Post by Admin on Dec 21, 2014 16:28:19 GMT -8
Speed piker gains speed.
All non-sorcery cards are supposed to evolve. There may be some oversights - for example we recently fixed a problem where Ironwood Golem evolving from level 2 to 3 didn't do anything.
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Post by xuande on Dec 22, 2014 4:32:02 GMT -8
I've been evolving quite a lot of cards, and I think there's only one or two cards with an evolve problem. I know there's a card that gains two defense on its Lv4 promotion, not sure if that was intentional or not.
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Post by Admin on Dec 22, 2014 16:50:16 GMT -8
Hmm..that's probably not intentional.
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Post by Zscout on Dec 29, 2014 18:23:04 GMT -8
I think the evolve for the sniper seems to be broken as well. I couldn't see a change in rank 3 or 4. I checked for speed and text subtlety and couldn't see it.
Thanks
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Post by Admin on Dec 30, 2014 14:32:35 GMT -8
Ok, we have a few fixed we'll be pushing soon, will check out sniper.
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Post by xuande on Jan 1, 2015 20:01:55 GMT -8
Great Red Dragon gains +2 Attack at Lv4. Falcon gains +2 Defense on Lv3. I actually evolved a Sniper today, it seemed to be working properly. IIRC, Rank 3 brings the TP cost reduction and Rank 4 brings +1 Attack.
If there's one card I don't understand currently, its Shieldbearer. If that card was two mana instead of three and had normal HP, with non-silly promotions (Lv4 is +2 HP, really?), then maybe it could see serious play. As it is, the Turtle is nearly its equal at two mana less, with a beast synergy to boot. Yes, the Shield effect blocks two magical damage, and yes, sometimes Shieldbearer can do more damage per round vs lower defense targets...but you can have a serious argument about which is better, and that's rather sad given their mana cost difference.
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Post by Zscout on Jan 2, 2015 9:12:48 GMT -8
Great Red Dragon gains +2 Attack at Lv4. Falcon gains +2 Defense on Lv3. I actually evolved a Sniper today, it seemed to be working properly. IIRC, Rank 3 brings the TP cost reduction and Rank 4 brings +1 Attack. If there's one card I don't understand currently, its Shieldbearer. If that card was two mana instead of three and had normal HP, with non-silly promotions (Lv4 is +2 HP, really?), then maybe it could see serious play. As it is, the Turtle is nearly its equal at two mana less, with a beast synergy to boot. Yes, the Shield effect blocks two magical damage, and yes, sometimes Shieldbearer can do more damage per round vs lower defense targets...but you can have a serious argument about which is better, and that's rather sad given their mana cost difference. I agree on Shieldbearer. The cost is too high for what you get. That said, I almost think it needs a boost instead of a cost reduction. Right now it seems that magic damage is slightly op and there aren't enough cards to counter it. Wyvern/Lich/Firesage combos are dominating league play and other than Mountain Troll and Cave Troll, there isn't really a lot left to mitigate direct damage.
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Post by xuande on Jan 2, 2015 14:46:53 GMT -8
Be careful when judging game balance - it isn't as easy as you think, and none of us really have a majority of Lv4 cards yet. That being said, my opinion so far...
Magic damage is OP in the sense that the best single-card counters to it happen to be woefully weak vs the field ([Lv3+ for 10 MP cost] Anti-Mage, [Lv4 for 150% heal] Mountain Troll). When you run cards like these and your opponent isn't running any damage-based magic (majority of League isn't, and there's still many intermediate players running Beast Tamer teams), you risk losing to them despite having a higher level team.
Also, there are ways for even those counters to be beaten. Anti-Mage can't always hit the ideal target (Fire Sage teams always run a second caster, and its possible to run three viably), and has the problems of needing a Water Wall and of only being able to cast on odd-numbered rounds. A Lv4 Mountain Troll (and it must be Lv4, or it will die to attrition) can actually hard-counter some sets, but this is why my Fire Sage teams usually run Water Wizardress (over cards like Soulstealer/Adept) - she can tank him in return, and eventually win via attrition if Fire Sage is killed or put below 4 HP prior to her dying.
Frenzy teams don't hard counter Fire Sage teams, but they have a legitimate shot at winning. It comes down to formation luck - does the Frenzy user have their hardest/fastest hitters lined up with the weaker tanks, or with the Water Wall? I have certainly been able to make Frenzy teams that win vs Fire Sage in Lab, but something as simple as inverting the formation can cause the opposite outcome.
I haven't made a serious TP-oriented team yet (Battle Tactician+Volcano and/or Coven) due to lacking some evolve levels, but I'm working towards making a viable TP team that can stand up to Fire Sage.
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Post by Zscout on Jan 3, 2015 6:52:42 GMT -8
I'm not suggesting balance is easy. I would argue it is the single most difficult thing in any game that I have ever played.
I'm amazed at how well balanced this game is for not having a large population to analyze and tweak. Development did a great job out of the box and I can't see where any significant changes are necessary.
The risk is always unintended consequences were you tweak one area and mess something else up.
My suggestion - which is very, very slight - is that they could consider a minor boost to a few of the weaker cards to mitigate in the magic area. Maybe even fix the Herald/Inquisitor so he is a more potent threat in his main role.
That said, the need for adjustment is minimal at this stage of the game and can wait until cards are fully evolved across the field. That is still weeks away for most of the population.
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Post by xuande on Jan 3, 2015 18:50:02 GMT -8
I think it would be better if Anti-Mage simply was less of an anchor vs non-spell teams, by giving him something like +1 Attack more than he has. I don't want single cards shutting down entire team types, but I also don't want players scared to run counters because of how bad they are outside of their intended role.
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Post by Admin on Jan 4, 2015 20:38:17 GMT -8
Hey guys, good feedback.
We will check out the evolves mentioned where guys get +2 stats and such, generally that shouldn't happen. (Though it is on purpose in some cases)
Herad and other hard counters are an interesting case. From what I remember the original version of him was better at being a hard counter, but that sort of hard counter is a little too all or nothing. Making him a little better against non-magic teams probably isn't a bad idea, given that he's a pretty soft counter even to magic teams. In general for guys with a potential to be crazy (shieldbearer, switch witch, fire bomb) we were a little conservative with them, so it may be a good idea to revisit some of them.
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Post by xuande on Jan 5, 2015 10:33:34 GMT -8
Cards I would suggest looking at:
Anti-Mage (Not much you can do here besides +1 Attack, he's going to be bad vs non-magic teams regardless since he's a back row, 3-cost unit)
Mountain Troll (Too fragile even at Lv4 vs physical attacks, because he "wastes" two of his evolves by improving his ability. I'd like to see that condensed somehow, so that he ends on four defense at a minimum. Going from Lv1 8 Atk/3 Def/22 HP to Lv4 8 Atk/3 Def/25 HP...well, that makes him worse than many leveled 1-cost units when you disregard his ability!)
Shieldbearer (Shield+2, with the way the Shield mechanic works, pretty much translates to Defense+2/Magic Defense+2. Having a slightly less bad attack rating over Snapping Turtle [who has a reasonable TP ability to compensate] and two Magic Defense isn't worth losing two HP and gaining two cost to play. Either buff the HP to compensate [starting HP 22, make the Lv4 evolve HP 25], or reduce his cost by 1.)
Fire Bomb (Too slow in this metagame. I think -5 MP requirement is a small and perfectly safe change, see if anyone can put it to use from there)
Decay (This needs to cost one, period. I know its a decent healing counter, but the value of the Sorcery slot means this is never going to see play unless a demo player has no other options)
Potent Poison (I'm just not seeing +1 delayed damage for poison-only attacks to be worth the 2-cost. Compare it to the various healing/+HP effects that cost 1-2 in the Sorcery slot, and it falls flat. Yes, this can help enable extra Assassin hits on occasion, but is that good enough? Its hard to come up with an appropriate change, because any reasonable buff will make several Campaign stages harder.)
I'm still somehow missing Rygar, Valko, and Swamp Beast despite at least fifteen Campaign runs, so I can't comment on those. I actually think Switch Witch is fine, since there's numerous counters to her effect.
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Post by JD on Jan 5, 2015 11:24:13 GMT -8
I think Hill Knight gains both defense and HP at level 4 and Ballista gains nothing at level 4.
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